Wind Farm

[longshanks]

Well pointed out Sven.
Allez Les Bleus!!!!
We can't do it so we get our old friends from across the channel to help out. Makes sense.
The question is why can't we do it.
One answer is probably that, for a long time (not anymore thankfully) nu-labour were in thrall of the pinko/hippy/eco lobby and stood against nuclear power so where did our nuclear scientists go? The land of brie and cognac and who can blame them.
I see the glow of sunrise (hopefully) on the horizon with our French build nuclear generation on the way.
Any chance of a tricolor smiley MacB?

Duc de Shank (Francophile by choice and, like Sven, an afficionado of the French habit)

[NickB]

The last thing I want tae see ur tidal barriers aw ower oor coastal waters

I'm not talking about tidal barrages Sandy - I am talking about tidal turbines. The schemes I am talking about would use deep water tidal turbines which are invisible and don't have any surface installation associated with them:





No visible intrusion, zero or minimal impact on marine ecosystems and able to supply a percentage of base load. There are technological issues to overcome in terms of maintainance in a harsh environment, but as I said in my previous post if anywhere has the expertise Scotland does. (The Lunar Energy turbines illustrated were developed by Rotech Subsea Ltd, a well-established Aberdeen-based sub-sea company).

[canUsmellthat]

PP:

"Raera Forest?"

"Ok its privately owned, but it still is a man made change in the local enviroment."

A proton eh...

The way forward must be a combination of them all; even nuclear, perhaps...

[Pentlandpirate]

Yes, A Proton Gen-2 Ecologic (1.6) Dual fuel. You have probably seen it but not recognised it as a Proton as it looks much more prestigious. It is effectively a Lotus as it is basically them that now makes it in Malaysia. So I can be quite satisfied knowing I've got cheap fuel, low emmissions, at under £10k new I can afford it, and I help feed a few thousand third world workers too.

So what do you drive CanU?

[canUsmellthat]

Ahhh, I saw that on top gear - they were very critical because the batteris ran out too quickly. I like the look of that honda that runs on hydrogen but they only use them in california and they're quite expensive to buy...

I drive a good british-made car that, by comparison, doesn't do the worst damage to the environment...

[Pentlandpirate]

I drive a good british-made car

That means it is either very old or it is a foreign make (unless you are driving a Morgan)

The Proton Ecologic is not one of those hybrid's. The dual fuels are petrol and LPG

[Seventhseil]

Well the turbines look good but again the tech will go to some other european country to develop, as with the palamis etc, when wee Jack McConnel was heralding spending 5million on a new research centre on orkney, the Portugese were spending 10 times that on thier research facilities. These things are of no intrest to the average central goverment minister as the don't seem to benifit London/Edinburgh/Glasgow.

As for the french biulding our Nuclear power generation, I find it worrying that as we become reliant on inported gas, the main supply options to europe being Russia (state owned GAZPROM) who have turned off the taps twice, and Norway (state owned Statoil) or shipping it from the middle east which is as politically volatile. Now the French state owned enterprises have control of our new electricity generation it makes us look like a shower of imbeciles who can't keep control of our own resources. surely its folly to let your utilitys to fall into the control of other govenments, not that I think we are going to go to war with any of these countries but if they have the ability to even threaten energy supply its a huge advantage for them.

But never mind we own a 65% share in some banks..........

[Pentlandpirate]

You can't trust the French for supply. Look at how often they strike or blocade our ports. If they can do that they can certainly turn the tap off to Britain.

.................and that's not even mentioning the War!

[canUsmellthat]

Scotland has no Gripe with France and vice versa, remembering the "Auld Alliance" an all but there is certainly no love loss between England and France...

As for your popular condescending jibe about the war, perhaps you should re-read your history books...maybe the parts about Dunkirk but you've probably got access to top secret documentation that makes you feel justified...

How is our war on terror anyway???

[Eric the Viking]

Hej Vic..

You can't trust the French

CHEESE EATING SURRENDER MONKEYS

Is it just me or is anyone else getting bored of PP and Shanksie's constant xenophobic stereotyping - it's nothing short of racist - Have you lost your yellow cards Vic (or maybe your bottle)?

[NickB]

I certainly don't think PP's comment is racist. The French have certainly demonstrated in the past that their own interests come first when push comes to shove, and I agree that it could be foolish to depend on France for a large percentage of our electricity supply. Recent events involving Russia and Ukraine which cut off gas supplies to other parts of Europe demonstrate this.



As for LS - let's wait for a Frenchman to complain shall we? Yes, the expression could be construed as a racial slur, but as its origin is my favourite town in the land of the burger-eating invasion monkeys - Springfield - and has been voted the most amusing racial slur ever I don't propose to do anything. It has after all been used on television by weel-kent figures without the concommittent outrage, sackings or suspensions associated with other racial insults, and I bet even Carol Thatcher would have got away with it in the Green Room.

Should the vicar take another view that is of course his/her prerogative.

Surprised to find that you are one of the PC Polis Eric.

[Maggie]

You can't trust the French

Well, I certainly think that's racist. Its stereotyping every Frenchperson as being untrustworthy. I have a French grandmother and feel she has been insulted by that statement.
Its no less racist than saying you can't trust the jews.
I think Longshanks's reference may be racist too but it does'nt actually name the French so maybe not.
I think the Crimson Vicar should speak up but don't hold up much hope as he didn't respond when I suffered sexual harassment on here recently.

[Eric the Viking]

You can't trust the English

Is that racist?

[NickB]

You can't trust the English

Is that racist?

No. It is an opinion. My only criticism might be that it is a bit of a sweeping generalisation, but that isn't against the rules of the forum. I think what makes a remark racist depends on the place and manner of delivery, the audience and the intention behind it.
I must remind you again however that this has nothing to do with windfarms and is severely , so if you want to continue this interesting but non-windfarm related discussion I will move the relevant posts to a new thread. Would that be acceptable, or will the forum resound with cries of fascist and accusations of control freakery again?

Please try to stick to the topic, and start a new thread if you want to discuss something else.

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[Pentlandpirate]

This is just ridiculous. I’m rascist? I even went to France on holiday and liked it so much I went back!

Perhaps, because of my work, I may be more conscious than some of how frequently French fishermen, farmers, truck drivers, air-traffic controllers, dock workers, etc, etc, have restricted the movement of food, goods and people in and out of the UK (they don’t seem to care if they affect English or Scots). In my view the French have often demonstrated their willingness to strike if they have a dispute, holding organisations to ransom.. If they can stop movement of food, goods and people in and out of our country I see no reason why they would not consider turning the lights off in Britain (and Scotland).

As for the Auld Alliance, do some of you think it still exists? Even a couple of centuries ago when Scotland needed help, where was the French Army? The Auld Alliance is respected by France when it suits the French. It has never worked the other way round.

By the way CanU, we are winning the war on terror. Britain’s Threat level has been reduced.

The stupid Card waving and Rules fiasco a month or two ago nearly stifled this website to death. Thankfully some sanity, and a degree of common sense, is returning. We have to rid ourselves of the crazy PC extremists!

Anyhow, we MUST become self-sufficient in energy. The only way we can realistically do this quickly is by going nuclear. And given the job situation we should commit to it now, ensuring that French compnaies use local workers where possible!

[NickB]

I think wind farms are a disgusting blot on the landscape.

P, I can't help wondering - would you be quite such a keen advocate of new nukes if the next one was going to be built up at Raera?

[Pentlandpirate]

Well I did spend much of my life living 6 miles down wind from Dounreay, so I probably don't have such a big problem with it as you might think. It was over a hill out of sight.

I tell you what, it meant jobs, and an influx of skilled, intelligent young people. It meant investment in the roads (all single track roads were re-surfaced every year or two) housing, schools, hospital, money into the coffers of the local council...the whole of society prospered in the area.

It's fear of the unknown that scares people. Through living, and working, with the people responsible for running the place you begin to understand the nuclear industry is not as scarey as you might think. If you knew more you might want to attract a nuclear power station to your area!

[Sandy MacSeil]

I agree 100% with PP. Indeed I think that we should seriously consider offering Seil as a site for a future modern nuclear power plant. Increasingly, the emphasis is on rewarding the local stakeholder communities and so we would know a level of prosperity unknown in Seil's history, plus we would accumulate a new vibrant mixed-age, mixed cultural working population with loads of spinoff to existing businesses, plus we would get decent roads and infrastructure and we'd have new housing and currently unimaginable recreational resources. We also have been trained over several years now on how to handle with slight dignity the disruption involved during the period of construction. These new reactors are safe and ultraclean and they can locate the Seil one behind my place if they give me extra dosh.

P.S. I have typed this in polite English language in order to mollify those boring pedants like Longdrawers who, perhaps slightly racistly, complained about my vulgar working man's Scottish accent.

[NickB]

If you knew more you might want to attract a nuclear power station to your area!

Sorry but no . . . I know you didn't mean to be patronising, but I was an active campaigner against nuclear power stations for quite a few years. It was some time ago - I was at the occupation of the Torness site at the very beginning of its construction - but nothing I have heard, seen or read since than has done anything to make me think that the technology is any more appropriate or economically viable now than it was then.*

I believe that new hydro schemes and the accelerated development of clean coal and renewables will mean that when Hunterston and Torness come to the end of their lives Scotland will still be a net exporter of electricity. If Westminster want to let the French build and run new nukes in England then that is their prerogative, but IMO it would be nice to see Scotland manage without.

And yes, I know the Swedes have recently lifted their nuclear embargo - but I liked the quote from Greenpeace spokeswoman Martina Kruger:
"To rely on nuclear power to reduce CO2 emissions is like smoking to lose weight. It's not a good idea."

*(apart perhaps from Sandy's fulsome tribute to the joys of nuclear power stations in the post above

[Eric the Viking]

What about Sandside beach and the surrounding seabed and all the radioactive c**p that will remain a danger for hundreds of generations to come - not much chance of getting cancer from a decommissioned wind farm????