Seil Chat

What a shame for all of us on Seil - http://www.bruceandco.co.uk/property.php?propid=36095

Indeed! For that price, one could discontinue the shop facility and have a nice (not so) little holiday home...

consortium anyone???

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The business is for sale leasehold Canu - the building is not for sale, the new proprietors will still be paying rent to the owner, so I don't see much danger of it becoming a holiday home. I do worry though . . . we sold a village shop in rural Aberdeenshire before moving to Seil and the daft woman who bought it closed it within six months. It takes a lot of committment to run a village shop and starry eyed wannabees moving up from the cities of the South do not always have what it takes, so fingers crossed . . .

Admin wrote:.
The business is for sale leasehold and starry eyed wannabees moving up from the cities of the South do not always have what it takes, so fingers crossed . . .

Anyone prepared to take on the shop, *Southerner* or not gets my vote.

longshanks wrote:

Admin wrote:.
The business is for sale leasehold and starry eyed wannabees moving up from the cities of the South do not always have what it takes, so fingers crossed . . .

Anyone prepared to take on the shop, *Southerner* or not gets my vote.

Didn't know the job was up for election. Where's my polling card?

Herby Dice wrote:

longshanks wrote:

Admin wrote:.
The business is for sale leasehold and starry eyed wannabees moving up from the cities of the South do not always have what it takes, so fingers crossed . . .

Anyone prepared to take on the shop, *Southerner* or not gets my vote.

Didn't know the job was up for election. Where's my polling card?

,Gets my vote, Herby, is a figure of speech which signifies approval. So don't panic, there is no election and your polling card has not gone missing.

I agree with you , Longshanks. It will need a real miracle to have new shop owners who will maintain the fantastic standards of our shop. We remember past times before the present owners when the choice of goods and the friendliness on show were far inferior. In these hard economic times and with guillotines hanging over all small post offices, the prospects are particularly bleak. The present owners are enthusiasts and committed professionals, working horrendous hours because they have enjoyed providing a great service. So if we can find anyone of whatever nationality to take the shop on and keep providing the great range of present provisions and services, they'll have my vote and thanks as well!

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Sandy, I hope you haven't misinterpreted my post. I trust that if and when it happens we will all welcome our new shopkeepers wherever they come from. We just need to hope that they are shopkeepers at heart. My remark re. 'starry-eyed Southerners' was made from personal experience - we had a village shop and post office in rural Aberdeenshire for seven years and it was on the market for two years before we sold it. We (with the bank) owned the property, so we could have simply shut the shop and sold it as a house - it would have sold quicker and we would probably have got more for it. We were determined not to do that however, as losing a shop and post office is a big setback for a small community - and running it is a responsibility as well as a job.

When we eventually found a buyer who was prepared and seemed keen to keep the shop and post office open we were delighted. Within a few short months however she had alienated most of our former customers and closed the shop down. It is a private house now and the village is still without a shop or post office.

It is simply not a job that anyone can do - it needs a huge amount of committment and hard work, whereas it turned out that the person we sold to had no more than a vague fantasy of running a village shop. That was the essence of my remark. We will certainly be very lucky if we get anyone half as conscientious and hard-working and just simply excellent at running a shop as Jean and Alastair.

In the meantime - and again this is from personal experience - it is very important that we all keep using the shop as much or more than ever in the run-up to the eventual sale, which will probably take a while.

I, too, am a little concerned.
It would be nice if a "local" couple took on the lease but raising the finance may be a bar to some, but I may be wrong.
I would be prepared to put up half the purchase price in return for 5% of the turnover annually over ten years, and that 5% would include the return of capital.
If any of you know anyone who are talking as though they'd like to run the shop but are saying they can't afford the lease then pm me with real world contact details and we can take it from there.

NoS

What's this - Dragon's Den?

I'm out

Appreciate the humour, Eric, but I am serious.

That's a really positive offer, NoS, and a good direction for this thread to go in but it seems to involve you increasing your capital by at least 200% over 10 years and probably by a good bit more than that so it doesn't seem to be all that altruistic or encouraging! Can you not do a bit better?

Sure, Sandy, once the capital is stripped out it amounts to an ROI of 20% p.a. which is fair for a high risk, unsecured investment, but that's not the point.
The point is that there may be one, or more, local couples who would love to take on the shop but (in current crunch times) cannot raise the necessaries.
I would love to see the shop kept truly local and am keen to help any entrepreneural and hardworking fellow islanders.
I'm offering only half the money as I feel a financial commitment (the other half) is necessary for a prospective, active, business partner. I am not offering a route putting them in debt. If the business fails or turnover slumps I lose my money or a good part of it.
If turnover remains, for example, at c£400,000 then the shopkeeper would probably net a profit of around 50,000 pa even after my 5% comes out. And they would receive free accomodation. Pretty attractive for someone but not attainable if they cannot raise the purchase price monies in the first place (and a short term loan for stock).

NoS

Don't forget that the shopkeepers will still have to pay a probably increasing and exorbitant rent to the shop/house owner. Not easy to work 90 hours a week, pay you back, pay the property owner, pay some staff, pay for the never-ending modifications to the shop being required by new legislation and still make a decent few bucks. However, I appreciate that you are making a semi-reasonable offer and I agree with your wish to encourage some local folk to apply (hence one of the reasons I posted initially) as I guess that otherwise the main target area for the sale will be way down south, seeking a lifestyle-changer. But, as I've said before, the over-riding concern is to preserve the shop and the great levels of service and stock established and developed brilliantly by Alistair & Jean.

[quote="Sandy MacSeil"]Don't forget that the shopkeepers will still have to pay a probably increasing and exorbitant rent to the shop/house owner..... pay you back ....(etc) [/quote]
Just to clarify, Sandy:
1. The property is Leasehold so only a ground rent is payable.
2. I am not proposing to lend anything. I am proposing to purchase a half share in the lease as a sleeping partner, with a right to 5% of turnover. The new shopkeepers would have no debt to me and would not be obliged to pay me back anything, not even interest. However I would have a 5% lien on the gross turnover. The idea is to make it easier for a cash-strapped and less than 'creditworthy' local couple to take on the shop and attempt to continue to run it to A and J,s remarkably high standards.
At the end of the day if someone from outwith Seil eventually takes on the shop that's fine by me. To me it wouldn't matter at all if they came from "Downsouth" or Mars, just so long as the shop continues in its current form. I do realise, however, that local people may not find it as easy to buy as, for example, maybe someone from Edinburgh, or Peebles, or Tonbridge...hence my offer.

novus ordo seclorum wrote:

Sandy MacSeil wrote:Don't forget that the shopkeepers will still have to pay a probably increasing and exorbitant rent to the shop/house owner..... pay you back ....(etc)

Just to clarify, Sandy:
1. The property is Leasehold so only a ground rent is payable.

Leasehold essentially means a long term tenancy. I think you will find that a substantial commercial rent applies.

The only figure that has been published in the advertisement is the turnover. I do not think that this is a suitable place for speculation regarding profits, rents etc, and anyone reading the posts above should be aware that any figures NOS or anyone else might have mentioned are no more than guesswork on their part.

While it is gratifying to see a potential business angel coming forward I do not want to see any further discusson of financial matters concerning the shop on here which could predjudice the sale - anyone interested in NOS's proposal should first of all contact the vendors with a view to obtaining further information on which to base a business plan and should then contact NOS by PM on this forum or by some other means.

Nick, I feel that your approach is a bit heavy handed and unhelpful. This thread was perhaps on track to produce something useful. Indeed it already has, thanks to NoS. Nowhere has there been anything particularly prejudicial or confidential about finances raised, just some chat and some ideas and so far an offer of help to locals. Lighten up and let it go - it might just come up with something good.

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I had good reason to post what I did and will remove any further financial speculation about the profits / rent etc of the shop. Only publicly available data may be posted, and even that may be removed if Jean and Alastair request it.

Sandy, I have sent you a PM. The rest of you, if you intend to start criticising the attitude / decisions / parentage of the moderator then please start another thread for this purpose and fill your boots. Any further off-topic posts on this thread will be removed.

Sorry if we are upsetting Alistair & Jean. We are actually just trying to help them and we are attempting to secure a good future for the shop.

Sandy MacSeil wrote:Sorry if we are upsetting Alistair & Jean. We are actually just trying to help them and we are attempting to secure a good future for the shop.

I am sure that is what we all want. It isn't likely to happen tomorrow though and in the meantime the shop is as excellent as ever. I've locked the thread now as it was going seriously off topic. Thanks Sandy for making everyone aware, thanks NOS for offering to be a local business angel.