Dogs and the golf course

[Kathy Bowles]

If you have a dog you have the responsibility of cleaning up after it - not difficult. I and a friend watched a dog owner casually walk away - my friend happens to be a dog warden in another part of Scotland and immediately shouted at the woman who claimed it was not her dog who did it - we had just seen it!! A respectable? member of the community no less?????

[TrickyDicky]

I very rarely post on this forum, as I find it hard to accept members posting under pseudonyms. If you've got something constructive to say, why do you need to hide away like a scared rabbit ??. Do you have any moral backbone ? Do you not have the strength of your convictions ?

I find this dictate from the Golf Club without imagination and quite offensive. Would it not be possible for local dog walkers and members of the golf club to meet and discuss the problems amicably. There obviously needs to be some education as to the real problems, but surely these could be thrashed out at a joint meeting. All this dictate has done is to alienate local dog walkers and exasperate the situation. It would be nice to see some common sense for once !

Regards, Richard Wesley (Tricky Dicky)

[MonaLott]

There are several good academic papers on the pros and cons of blogging anonimously but your childish and insulting accusations aren't included in these, TrickyDicky. If that tone transferred into your proposed meeting, the chances of success would be nil!

[TrickyDicky]

MonaLott, very apt pseudonym, whoever you are, you have not answered the question I posted, but have made some obscure reference to academic papers. Perhaps you could give more details, whoever you are ?, or perhaps that's a secret too !!!

I ask this very direct question to all bloggers here. Who would you rather deal with at a meeting, somebody who you know, or some unknown character who hides behind a mask ???

Regards Richard Wesley

PS Monalott my name is Richard not Tricky Dicky did you miss that ???

[NickB]

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I fail to understand the animosity expressed by dog owners at the actions of the golf club. It is their land and they are quite within their rights to request that dogs are kept on a lead at all times. Similarly, they have a right should they so choose to exempt their own employees or members from that requirement - although I can see why that might cause some resentment.

Lets face it, it is the behaviour of some (not all) dog owners that has brought this about. In the last few years I have seen dogs allowed to run free among livestock, including pregnant sheep. I have seen dogs defecating on grass verges with owners making no attempt to pick up the mess and - even worse - read posts on here by dog owners claiming that as this is 'the countryside' there is no reason why they should pick up their dogs' faeces. And with the golf course as far as I know the problem is not just faeces - there is the issue of damage to the greens when they are waterlogged.

The golf club have no need as far as I can see to have a meeting with anyone - all they are doing is requesting compliance with the law after a long period of ineffectually asking for co-operation on a voluntary basis. The apparently unrepentant attitude of some dog owners on here is unlikely to encourage them to change their stance.

As regards anonymity - there are many who are uncomfortable with the concept and so do not use this forum. However, anonymity has allowed lots of people to participate in discussions that they would - for whatever reason - not have felt able to enter under their own identities. As a long-time user of the internet I am of the opinion that the option of anonymity is overall a good thing. There is nothing to stop people posting under their own names, and many do - but anonymity will continue to be allowed, encouraged and guaranteed on this forum for those who want it provided they remain within the forum guidelines.

[MonaLott]

Well said, Nick. By the way, is there also an issue of loose dog-walking on the playing field at Ellenabeich? Seems even worse where the local primary kids are playing?

[TrickyDicky]

Thanks Nick, at last a proper debate, with someone I know and respect. I would like to state that I am not a dog walker, but I am expressing the views of several friends and dog owners who have been upset by this dictate.

Most of the points you have raised Nick are valid and need addressing, but I think you are more likely to get the concensus of dog walkers if this is done without issuing an ultimatum. The Golf Club have every right to protect their greens and fairways but some of the culprits are their own members !! Let's solve this problem by discussing this issue and not laying down the law without any consultation. Walkers have a right to cross the golf course as long as they have respect for golf club members. Don't forget that this area was used by locals for recreation, long before the golf course was created.

With regard to anonymity that is fine if it is done without prejudice or malice, but I'm afraid that some of your bloggers delight in using their pseudonyms to express very personal and hurtful remarks which bear no relation to the truth !! Are you are aware that comments made on this forum actually deter visitors from coming to our island ?

Regards, Richard Wesley (Balvicar)

[NickB]

With regard to anonymity that is fine if it is done without prejudice or malice, but I'm afraid that some of your bloggers delight in using their pseudonyms to express very personal and hurtful remarks which bear no relation to the truth !! Are you are aware that comments made on this forum actually deter visitors from coming to our island ?

This is a moderated forum Richard. The forum terms and conditions specifically forbid the abuse of other forum users. All complaints are looked into, but it is inevitable that one person's light hearted banter is another person's hurtful remark - and vice versa. This is why the majority of posters choose to post anonymously - less danger of it being taken personally. And let's face it - no-one is compelled to post or even to read the forum.

As for the suggestion that comments on this forum prevent people coming to the island - well, they must be a bit daft if a bit of local chit-chat puts them off - or did they think they were coming to a theme park? Frankly I find your assertion hard to believe, and challenge any would-be visitor to Seil who has been specifically put off coming here by posts on this forum to register and post their reasons here.

[TrickyDicky]

Nick, I speak from my own experience of your forum and comments from others and visitors to the island. If you choose not to accept that, then your not the man I thought you were.

I have entered into this dialogue, with an open mind and had hoped for a proper debate, but you seem to have gone onto the defensive already. I'm not trying to criticise yourself, but some of the practices that have become a feature of this forum.

I think you will find it very unlikely that visitors to the island who feel intimidated by some of the comments made on the forum are going to thrown themselves into the lion's den. Also many residents on Seil will not participate here because of the points I have already raised. Let's have a forum to be proud of and not one that people are scared to join

Lighten up please, and let's have a proper debate about this important issue, otherwise I will be signing off for the last time.

And I am sure MonaLott, that will suit you just fine, because sometimes home truths are hard to accept ?

Regards, Richard Wesley (Balvicar)

[Foxglove]

Goodness me! there are some sensitive souls about , I would not expect to hear of anyone who has been put off by remarks on here..if there are some then maybe they should leave forums alone. The problem of dogs on the golf course is a subject worthy of debate, personally I do not care either way [not a golfer or a dog owner] but am interested in peoples comments. Chill out

[NickB]

Let's have a forum to be proud of and not one that people are scared to join

Care to explain how to achieve that?

How would you run this forum?

[MsAnnThrope]

Nothing wrong with the forum as it is.
For the benefit of Tricky Wesley the golf course was previously farming ground, maybe he hasn't been around here long enough to remember?
As regards pseudonyms even Clachan Bridge has been given one!

[MonaLott]

TrickyDicky, I'm beginning to feel sorry for you. Next time you blog, please don't start by insulting us all. A bit more humility and a bit less ego would be wonderful. Why you want to insult us then complain about being insulted is puzzling, as is why, in that context, you wouldn't prefer to be anonymous. You are elsewhere doing a lot of good for this community and we all hope you'll feel warmer towards our local blog soon. Anyway, as both a golfer and a
dog-walker, I am entirely on the side of the golf club. Making a golf course out of a boggy field is a fantastic achievement. Walking a dog isn't.

[TrickyDicky]

Nick, I speak with some experience, as I run two forums locally, with over a hundred members in each. The simple solution is, you do not allow pseudonyms on this site. What on earth are people scared of, their own shadows ?? We have heated discussions at times on our forums, but it's all done with consideration and respect. The bloggers you lose because they cannot hide behind the flag, will be replaced with double the number !

What is a problem though, is comments like, " maybe he hasn't been around here long enough to remember? ". For your information Miss Ian Thrope-Big Nose, I can remember when part of the now golf course was scrub-land, an area that was rich in wildlife. I have only lived permanently on the island for seven years, does that still mean I'm still an incomer, or is it because I'm English. My heart is in Scotland, and if I could become a nationalised Scot I would, I even vote for Alex Salmond, for my sins.

My son contributes towards the community as Manager of Atlantis Leisure and my daughter-in-law is a Community Nurse looking after dying patients around Oban. My grand-children are both attending Oban High School and my wife helps at the Lunch Club, SNHG meetings, and most events that happen at the hall. What do we have to do to become accepted, throw ourselves of Clachan Bridge ??

Regards, Richard Wesley (Balvicar)

[Foxglove]

Trickydicky, maybe you should not worry too much about being accepted as a 'local', I'm English and could not care less whether the local Scots like us here or not [there are plenty of Scots living and working in England!], take as you find...most people are friendly to you if you treat them with respect. I cannot understand why the Dogs/Golf Course debate has turned into some backbiting and 'sort of' racist spat?

[NickB]

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Richard,

I am sorry, but I am not going to change the rules of the forum to make people post under real names. Apart from anything else, it is not enforceable as I would have to somehow check everybody's IDs in some way. What, for example, would there be to stop someone registering as Richard Wesley when in fact they are someone else?

There is a well-known saying - 'on the internet no-one knows you are a dog'. It is both a blessing and a curse.

As for 'personal' comments - don't be so sensitive. I have taken a lot more stick than you on this forum over the years, which is particularly galling when it is me who puts in the hours and foots the bills. If you don't like it you don't have to read or post.

[RichardW]

It's really not that difficult Nick, if you moderate registration by email and phone number it soon sorts the wheat from the chaff. Even if somebody slips through, its soon pretty obvious.

However I sense you don't really want to change, and that's your prerogative, when all's said and done, you must have spent many hours setting up Seil online on a purely unselfish basis. So thanks for that, its certainly the place to come if you want to know what's happening on Seil.

Unfortunately I will no longer be participating in your forums, as I also have free choice. This I'm sure will be good news to fellow bloggers MonaLott and MsAnThrope. I have to say that MsAnThrope is an excellent choice for a pseudonym considering the meaning "a person who hates humankind or a person who avoids human society". Rock on Big Nose. keep the misery coming !!

Regards, Richard Wesley (Balvicar)

[RichardW]

Thank you for your concern Digitalis purpurea, I have a pretty hard shell, just stated a few facts to make a point. I will be leaving the forum soon, so no need to worry on my behalf.

Regards, RichardW

[Maggie]

Quite simply this is a matter between the golf club and a few irresponsible walkers and it is none of anyone else's business unless they are golfers or people who walk across the course for exercise or pleasure.
All this discussion here is doing is stirring up disharmony on Seil and creating a bad impression of our community; it is most certainly not doing anything to solve the problem.
I would like to suggest that to those who this is none of their business stop butting in and stoking the disharmony.

mags
x x

[NickB]

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I suspect most of the contributors to this thread do indeed walk on the golf course from time to time, with or without dogs. That is precisely why this subject has stirred up such interest. If you do not enjoy the golf course yourself Maggie then why are you on here telling us who should and should not be posting? I have to say that of all the contributions to this thread I find yours the least comprehensible, though I am sure you mean well.

I for one am getting a bit fed up with people telling me how this forum should be run. It is run in much the same way as a thousand other internet fora. It is fairly moderated, does not tolerate personal abuse and does not force itself down peoples throats in any way. It certainly does not take it upon itself to 'sort the wheat from the chaff'. There is no content or subject matter that reveals anything other than a small section of a small West Coast community expressing their views on local matters. If that 'puts people off coming to the island' because it shows that there are real people living here then too bad - Seil is not a theme park for tourists, it is a place people live.

This forum has been in existence now for eight years, during which time its popularity in terms of useage has gone up and down. I've kept it going in the face of personal abuse online, muttered disapproval offline and long spells of disinterest, and as far as I am concerned it will remain in existence while there is a server to host it. It is here as a conduit for peoples views and ideas if they choose to use it. If people don't want it then don't use it, simples!