WIND FARM POLL

[longshanks]

Based on your current level of understanding of what is proposed.

[NickB]

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I see you managed to set up a poll. Good. Hopefully that will encourage others to do so when appropriate.

I haven't voted because I have no strong feelings either way. I am in favour because it will generate some clean power, it is better than the joke of 'clean coal', and I don't think it will damage the environment in any way.

On the other hand I am against because I don't think wind is going to be able to fill the looming 'energy gap' but I do think companies like nPower are making a lot of money under what are essentially false pretences.

I will be interested to see the results however.

Regards, W

(sitting on the fence by choice)

[longshanks]

I haven't voted ......... I am in favour because ......... On the other hand I am against because .......

Easily solved Mr Admin, Sir.
Why not cast one vote in favour using your "admin" identity and then one vote against using your "ChristopherBooker" identity. Your other identities ("swarm" et al) can then abstain. Problem solved eh?
You're welcome.

Surveillance Shanks (I.D. cards by choice)

[DiscoClint]

I'm all for them. Although by no means a fix for the looming energy crisis, they are a step in the right direction. The more the better. I think the effect that they have on the landscape is a small price to pay. Beside they look a hell of a lot better than the hundreds of power stations you pass as you drive through middle England. I'd rather have a windfarm any day.

Npower, on the other hand, can be a real pain in the @rse, but I think that is part of the parcel for any energy provider.

[Pentlandpirate]

Beside they look a hell of a lot better than the hundreds of power stations you pass as you drive through middle England

I can think of one I see near Carlisle and a big one near Leeds, one by Widnes but I can't remember seeing 'hundreds of others'. Where are the hundreds you see?

But I can think of numerous nameless locations where I've seen wind turbines. These are much more numerous and I hate them.

The good thing is you know that they can be easily removed when they eventually admit they are not the best idea, and the landscape can be returned to its former glory. It's just a shame our lives, in today's generations, will be spoilt by these blots on our environment. If this is what is so good about 'environmentalism', I don't want it.

[ChristopherBooker]

I can think of numerous nameless locations where I've seen wind turbines. These are much more numerous and I hate them.

I find this illogical. What's to hate? Surely you are mature enough to be able to redefine your thinking on this and so reduce the stress you feel?

It's just a shame our lives, in today's generations, will be spoilt by these blots on our environment.

One of the most selfish statements I have read for a while. How old are you? Do you remember Supermac's 'You've never had it so good'? He was speaking about (y)our generation. What an easy life we have had - and now we will rage against the machine because we have to look at a few turbines . . . . surely not?

Chris Booker

[NickB]

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The good thing is you know that they can be easily removed

Not an argument in their favour that I have heard before, but one which I have to agree with. Certainly a much simpler proposition than decommissioning a bunch of nuclear power stations in 30 or 35 years time.

[longshanks]

Surely you are mature enough ........ reduce the stress you feel ........ One of the most selfish statements I have read ..... How old are you?
Chris Booker

I am stunned by the temerity of a, so-called, newbie to this forum. To launch into such an attack on the character of a well established and respected member is outrageous.
Mr MacBooker, sir; learn some manners !

Shocked Shanks (polite by breeding and choice)

[longshanks]

What on earth is happening here. Last time I looked (this morning) the yes vote count was nine. Now it has gone down to six !
Who is manipulating this and why on earth cannot it be stopped?
Call in a forensic I.T. expert I say......open polls were withdrawn due to gross and blatant manipulation and now it is clear that someone is manipulating member-only polls.
Find the culprit and kick her out!

Zanu Shanks (Iranian President by choice)

[khartoumteddy]

ok im in favour up to a point


if the siting is realistic they could do some good
:jack
off shore wind farms could be tied in to conservation areas
perhaps giving fish stocks some chance of recovery

on shore why not in more remote areas
which may not be easily farmed

and does anyone think that the modern countryside owes nothing to past commercial and farming systems

[NickB]

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Shanks,

Six and nine can look very similar - have you been in the pub again?

I can assure you that this poll has not been manipulated in any way - indeed, there is no way to do it without hand-editing the database, and I can assure you I have had more important things to do today.

[Pentlandpirate]

Dear Mr Booker,
I don't know where you come from, and I don't much care, but

I find this illogical. What's to hate? Surely you are mature enough to be able to redefine your thinking on this and so reduce the stress you feel?

Yes, I'll say it again, I hate these things. They do stress me, because they are a monstrosity. I can't believe the local opinion seems to be in their favour. Years ago I found myself down at Mostyn docks (or somewhere around there in North Wales). There they were joining the three blades together into a gigantic propeller, flat on a large hardened area. I was staggered at the size of just one blade, so much so that I decided to park my car under one of them and photograph it just to show others how huge these things are. And that's before they've been mounted on top of a huge tower. I may be selfish, definitely a NIMBY, but I quite like the way God shaped the Earth. I'm amazed that they appear to get the permission to build these things so easily, when it is so hard to even get a small alteration to your house, particularly if it is deemed 'out of character'. Since when were such king big things as these in keeping with the local environment? You lot must have gone soft.

PS What's Malcolm MacDonald got to do with this?

[NickB]

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Longshanks, it appears I owe you an apology.

There is an option in phpBB3 to allow people to change their vote in a poll. I have disabled this option in the Admin Control Panel because I do not think it is useful. However, it appears there was a bug in the latest update package from version 3.0.4 to version 3.0.5 of the software which left this option turned on no matter what the settings were elsewhere.

It seems therefore that people have been changing their vote. No-one has fiddled anything or altered the total number of votes cast, but some people who have already voted have changed their vote - which could account for the discrepancy you think you saw.

I have now applied a hotfix that has remedied this - no-one will be able to change their vote in this poll again or in any future polls.

[DiscoClint]

Let's see if I can work out the "quote" thing this time...

I can think of one I see near Carlisle and a big one near Leeds, one by Widnes but I can't remember seeing 'hundreds of others'. Where are the hundreds you see?

I didn't think anyone would actually go out and count them. You are quite correct, there are not hundreds in middle England. Apologies for exaggerating. But there are a lot:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_po ... in_England

Drive from Scotch corner to Hull and you'll see plenty.

Try this for an alternative argument. For years people living near power stations have had to put up with the pollution and related health problems they cause (not to mention the eyesore), whilst the people of Argyll have sat happily by and consumed the electricity they produce. Now there is the opportunity to contribute something to the national grid, without any resulting cost on health, and people are up in arms just because you can see them from a distance?! Would you rather a great big "clean" coal power station on the hill instead, or is it just a "not in my back garden" viewpoint?

And don't try to claim Cruachan dam does much more than allow the flow of water down hill when energy is worth a lot (during the day) and pump it up when electricity is cheap (at night), creating a net zero in energy production the majority of the time.

As for the point about liking the way God shaped Earth, I am quite a fan of how earth looks as well, but its going to look a damned sight worse (and dark at night) if we don't hurry up and find a way to replace fossil fuels. They ARE going to run out sooner or later, there is no stopping it. When this does happen (and it will) the countries with the most sources of alternate energy are going to be the big players. They might decide that the hill behind Ardmaddy will be better used as a nuclear waste dump...........

[DiscoClint]

I may be selfish, definitely a NIMBY,

I have only just realized that NIMBY means "Not In My Back Yard". Please disregard the query as to whether it was a not in my back garden statement. (Yes it is selfish to be a NIMBY).

[longshanks]

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Longshanks, it appears I owe you an apology.

Too right !
I look forward to receiving it.

Six and nine can look very similar

...and can get very sticky if you put them together.

Shankers (warmist by choice)

[longshanks]

Shame the software on this foruim is amateurish in regard to setting up new polls. What's the point of a forum without a poll facility?
Anyway MacB may be pleased to see I found this old one which should still work; just set it back to zero wwwebguru and away ye go.
Interesting to have another one after the big public meeting on the 3rd to see how far it swayed people's opinion.

Huckster Shanks (Pollster by choice)