Some interesting minutes this month . . .

[NickB]

The new Community Council Minutes from March are now available on the website.

Of particular interest is the re-emergence of the discussion re. a fixed link to Luing.

Please keep an eye open for the minutes each month - they go up at the same time the notice of the next meeting changes. It's not all complaining about holes in the road; some very important issues come up; this site is an opportunity to keep in touch and perhaps make your views known.

(Remember this forum supports polls)

- NickB

[Pentlandpirate]

If bridges and tunnels are too expensive, how about a pontoon?

[NickB]

What use would that be?

Nick

[Pentlandpirate]

It's a floating bridge....as used in D-Day landings.....quickly and cheaply built, could cost a fraction of other options.....but you get what you pay for..........it could get washed away in a storm

[MA1BOB]

For the right price, someone may be willing to row you across in a dingy. All you need is a stout beer, a pair of good wellies and a bright yellow slicker.

Cheers

Bob

[Pentlandpirate]

Don't think you'll get any of the locals to do that. Those that aren't lacking in energy or enthusiasm to make their world a better place, certainly give the impression they wouldn't do anything to help an outsider.

What do you think Bob looking from outside in...............we look on and wish we had what they have and all they seem to do is moan and squabble?

Is there trouble in paradise?

[MA1BOB]

Trouble in Paradise?

Not at all. The residents of Seil (in my opinion) are showing just concern for issues that directly impact thier everyday lives. Transportation, wether it be ferries or roads) definitly impact them daily. Where as outsiders may think that complaints about rough roads is trivial, those driving over those roads every day see it as an issue worth discussing.

I have made it very clear that I would emigrate to Seil today if I could. If I lived in an EU country, the process of moving to Scotland would be very straight forward. But living in the United States currently, the act of emigrating becomes more involved. It is estimated that approx. 20,000 Americans are leaving the country every month. This concerns our government deeply. Because as we leave, we have a tendency to take our money with us. So our government has made an arraingment with our economic allies to limit the amount of Americans that can emigrate to other countries. Great Britain has agreed to this scheme.

I recently went to Canada to visit friends and I was extensively grilled by customs upon my arrival back into the States. Why was I in Canada? What was my purpose of going there? Who did you visit and Why? Etc. Etc. As I am retired, the concern is that I was scoping out a place to live. Our passports are now implanted with RFID chips so that our government can track our movements if we leave the country.

But back to the subject: The residents of Luing and Easdale live in a difficult situation. If they need to commute to work everyday on the mainland they incur a serious cost concerning ferry fees and the high cost of petrol. I don't know if the children who need to commute to school get a break on the ferry fees or not. If not, that also is an added cost to living on the Islands. Over a years time I imagine that this runs into a lot of money. Please correct me if I am wrong on this.

Cheers

Bob

[wasseventhseil]

Pentland Pirate what is it we have that you want? or to pose your own question to you "why is the grass greener"?
I understand that we live in a very beutifull part of the world but it is far from paradise, the point of this forum is to discuss local issues,which for the most part we do. Although we complain and bitch we also try and find solutions.

Who's to say that you wouldn't complain too if you lived here?
Every one who has ever been on holiday has fallen into the trap of believing for a short time at least, that it would be wonderfull and relaxing to live in the place you have visited. Where as if you actually were experiencing life in that place your feelings would be totally different.

[Pentlandpirate]

As someone who has lived in 17 houses and 14 different areas (5 countries) for at least a year in any one house or place in just 48 years, I'm reasonably qualified to have learnt that no where is perfect. Having seen parts of 55 countries including the likes of New Zealand, Seychelles and many other beautiful places, in my book "home "is always best. Everything and every place has its downsides. I look on your community and see it is not perfect, but that it has many features which are attractive to 'outsiders' including me. Making changes in life is good in many ways. As they say it is not a rehearsal. You might as well cram in as much as you can. Changing your path in life allows you to experience new things. Sometimes these are degrees of good and bad experiences, but at least they allow you to appreciate what you have and do not have, that little bit more.

I recognise it is lacking in many things, more in choice of consumerist aspects of life. Many may demand greater nightlife, pubs, restaurants, cinemas, bowling alleys, social opportunities, bigger shops and retail parks, better transport links. But there is a segment (a growing one) of ageing people (NOS give me a break) that you cannot deny is attracted to the area BECAUSE they have sampled life and have the experience to know your area WILL give them what they are looking for. They are not worried about better schools, jobs, cheap housing as long as there is a decent doctor and a hospital nearby!

I know what the dark of long winters are like, I know what it's like to live a considerable distance from the nearest retail park or IKEA. I know what it's like to move into an area where I have no roots. Would I care about potholes in the road? Would I care that so many people have 4 x 4's? (you should see how many there are here) Would I care that the locals were not 'local' at all? No: I'm much more interested in enjoying the relative peace, space and sense of community that you have there compared to what everyone else has to accept as 'normal'.

[elephantseal]

Hmm, could the problem be that everyone is too busy hoofing around the world trying to find this 'inner peace' instead of just staying in one place and er, putting down roots?

(I know this is a terribly unfashionable idea at the moment as you can't be seen to be 'full of experience' unless you have travelled extensively)

[Pentlandpirate]

Whatever it is, "hoofing it around the place" does allow you to make comparisons, and can, with some measure, conclude that the grass is greener. Those that stay rooted can be limited by their horizons.

What should be considered relevant and special is having a mix of people from all backgrounds and experiences, sharing life together. The more diverse, the more to share. I think it's the 'sharing' part that many people feel is missing in too many "communities".

[elephantseal]

My point was only that the balance between a community that has a continuity of population (i.e. several generations of families) has been lost somewhat on Seil. This is for a variety of reasons, some historical, some economic. These reasons have been changing the population dynamic for hundreds of years, over and over.

I also don't think it's fair to chastise people for not wanting, or having the chance to, travel. To say people who don't travel have 'limited horizons' is pure mince in the extreme. Travel for the masses is a luxury that is afforded to us at present by a prosperous economy and cheap fuel. To see new things is no bad thing, but greater wonderment can often be found by looking more closely in the one place.

[Pentlandpirate]

OK, you don't have to travel to be better informed, and have a wider persepective on things, but it definitely helps.

I fully agree greater things can often be found by looking more closely in the one place. I am reminded that an American visitor stayed with us, and he said, " Did you know that the Town Hall....... and did you know that...." All the years I had lived here and I didn't know these things. Sometimes it takes an outsider to notice things under your nose, that you have been unaware of for years because you take so much for granted.

A bit of self-discovery can be quite an enriching exeprience!!!

[wasseventhseil]

Who has been complaining about not getting to IKEA?
I am sorry I do not see people not being able to afford even rented housing as a consumerist problem!
As for us all living here and never experiencing other climes or "experience's" how do you know?
Do you think we are as ignorant as to believe living else where will be much easier, it wo'nt it will be different and have different opertunitys but It will not be easier.Please do not insult us by impling as you have before that poor locals do not appreciate what they have,its a story thats as old as the hills!
Unfortunatly all your travelling has brought you to the same conclusion as most people who do not live in rural communitys ie; rural communitys are places you get away from life in, not places you start your life in.......

[Pentlandpirate]

Like you, I don't care where the nearest IKEA is. I don't need it; but for many in the UK they would consider facilities like a retail park being essential in the place they chose to live in.

The cost of rented property is linked to the cost of all property. People are buying property as an investment whether a holiday home, to live in or to let. I think on that basis you can say it is all part of our "consumerist" society.

I'm not so ignorant as to say the locals do not travel or experience other climes. Historically people from the Highlands & Islands have a greater record than most for going to the extremes of this planet. I was merely responding to the point that those who have travelled are perhaps in a better position to judge the grass is greener, by having seen the difference in life in other places.

Unfortunatly all your travelling has brought you to the same conclusion as most people who do not live in rural communitys ie; rural communitys are places you get away from life in, not places you start your life in.......

....and that's why so many "mature"people want to move to your area. They so often ARE people who started life in rural areas, went away to get work and when they had made a bit of money and experienced life elsewhere, have decided to return to the way of life they enjoyed in their youth........myself included.

Is it only local "locals" who are represented on this forum? Are the "incomers" too scared to speak up?

[elephantseal]

Pentland pirate, everyone is an incomer of sorts, some are newer than others.

A lot of the people that post on this site are concerned about the changing demographics of Seil, with the issues that this brings. The issue is not about, or has ever been about individuals moving to Seil, but rather the general process which has speeded up vastly in recent years. This is combined with a trend for older, retired people to move to Seil rather than younger families. As these older people can afford to pay more for houses the property market goes through the roof, thereby deterrring families from seeing Seil as a favourable (or economic) option.

It is not having a go at anybody, it is just the way it is. The danger is the growing disparity between what Seil thinks it should be and what it is going to become.

[Pentlandpirate]

What should it be?

What do you think it will be if nothing is done?

[elephantseal]

It is easily answerable easily enough by collating what the contributors to this site are saying, i.e a mixed demographic of people living in a place where there is the chance of some decent work and a (reasonably priced) place to live. I think most people in the world would see that as an attractive place to be.

If nothing is 'done', the danger is we have a more slewed demograhic that perpetuates itself - i.e house prices keep rising inordinately because of the 'escape to the country' and 'relocation, relocation' effects. A financially pushed young family are going to choose to live in Oban or elsewhere leaving Seil with an more mature (and probably at least partially retired) population. And before you say I besmirch the name of the mature, I am sure they would all be wonderful people and keen to contribute to the Island. My point is about the general trend of demographics.

I mean, does anyone need to be paying £110,000 for a one bedroom cottage in Toberonochy?

[Pentlandpirate]

An ageing population is a result of greater life expectancy. In leafy Cheshire, which is one of the most prosperous parts of the UK there are a dearth of newly built one and two bedroom, very desirable, flats built in prime locations priced at around £130,000. You would have thought they would have been snapped up, but the reality is the developers are struggling to sell ANY of them.

The reality is most people in work are taxed too much.....to pay for everyone else. Perhaps we need a government that will offer BIG tax concessions to first time buyers.

If a manufacturer wanted to stick a big factory on Seil to help re-generate the area, how would locals react to more traffic, environment issues, the peace being disturbed and even more pressure on property, forcing prices yet higher?

[Ticonderoga]

Somebody asked if it was only local locals who were using this site. If that's the case, then it's not before time. Too polite, too reticent and too much said behind closed doors for far too long.
Ageing populations seem to be the future for many European countries, and while not, by any means, an ideal basis for a vibrant community, they aren't necessarily the root of all evil.
Surely if we are talking about a shifting, rootless section of society moving into areas where there is a relatively rooted population, then attitude, not age, is the key factor.
A little less arrogance, a little more assimilation could go a long way to easing community frictions.